Hey guys, I just picked up a '90 Miata today and have a few questions. 1. I'm getting water in the trunk. After doing some interw3b searching and some testing with a bucket full of water, I'm pretty sure that the rain rail is cracked on the passenger side. Does anyone have experience with replacing this? I could probably do this with no problem, but I seriously don't have the time to do it now. I honestly don't want to have to resort to taking it to the dealership if I don't have to. 2. The tires that are on this are about as good as 4 rubber turds. Suggestions on new ones? The car is going to be my daily driver and won't ever see snow. My only requirement is that they aren't completely garbage in the rain. It would also be nice if the total price is $300 or less. Grip is nice, but they need to last more than a week also. Oh yeah, I could also really give a crap less about autocrossing this thing so don't start with any of the mod suggestions, either. I don't want to turn this thing into a money pit, lol. Thanks.
well, 90% of miatas are stock autocrossers, so its not so much of a money pit. However if you want advice from people who know miatas, the best resource locally is the autocross club at mnautox.com. There are tons of miata tires on sale there now, as well as lots of people who can help w/ your miata based problem.
Thanks for the advice, Zak. However afte a quick search over there I didn't really see anything regarding the rain rail as that is my main concern right now. So who's wants to replace the rain rail for me? $$$ And I'm still not going to autocross it, lol.
Funny, I just replaced the rain rail last year on a Miata I owned for a few months. If you have any inclination to replace the whole top, now is the time to do it. You can get a new top with it already attached, and it is a lot easier to swap the whole thing instead of removing and replacing the rail. I got the "unbreakable" one here: http://www.duettomotors.com/miata/rain_rail.htm The old one was brittle plastic and cracked to hell, this one is nice thick rubber. Rear deck carpet is plentiful and cheap on eBay if your is stanky from being wet. It isn't the hardest thing in the world, just takes time. Make sure you pull the whole top completely off. (for some reason I started without doing this, until I realized how easily it comes off.) There are really specific (low) torque values for reattaching the metal brackets, has to be just right to prevent leaks I guess. Unfortunately I have no particular desire to do it again, and even less time. If you want to get a quote from the dealer, I am curious how much it would be... if it is really outrageous maybe I could help. I dumped all my links, but I have some stuff I printed off, I'll see if I can find it. oh, I don't know what size wheels you have on it - I still have two mismatched 15" tires laying around, lots of tread, if you just want something to throw on it for awhile you are welcome to them.
Sweet, thanks for the input. I would rather not replace the entire top since they are pretty spendy -- the original owner of the car put in a new one with a glass window about a year before my Dad bought the car. So I would guess that the top is about ~5 years old or so. It's in really good shape and wouldn't make much sense to replace a $600 top when all I need is a $150 rain rail. I'll probably buy the tires new; I'm just looking for suggestions. They will be mounted on the stock 14" rims. Stock size is 185/60-14 but I may move to a 205/55-14 tire. I haven't had a chance to really look into how the rain rail is integrated in with the top (I've only had the car for a few hours and it's dark out, hehehe) but is it possible to maybe seal up the cracks with silicone or something?
yeah in that case, probably doesn't make sense.... You can't see the actual rain rail until you pull the deck carpet. (and maybe another trim piece, I forget exactly.) It kind of clamps around the bottom edge of the top, and creates a channel for water to run to the little drain holes on each side of the car. Oh - you need to make sure those are clear too, they could be plugged with 10 years of leaves and crud. Those are a trick to find - tucked in behind the seat belt towers. If it looks anything like mine did, there is no way you could seal it up. (it came off in like 8 pieces.) But if was replaced with the top it may not be in that bad of shape, maybe you could put a some silicon on the cracked part. Or it could just be that the 17 bolts or whatever just didn't get torqued properly. With the carpet out you can dump water on it and see exactly where it is coming in. I had Goodyear F1-GSD3s on my old one (I've had two of them) - the sidewalls were pretty soft, which sucked for turn-in response, but they were great in the rain. Toyo T1-Rs are similar. I guess for a daily driver I would get something like that with strong wet-handling; doesn't get much scarier than a Miata in a thunderstorm. (well except maybe a Miata in a blizzard...)
If you decide to stick with the stock size http://www.tirerack.com/tires/Sizes.jsp?make=Bridgestone&model=Potenza+RE960AS+Pole+Position These are awesome tires to have and only $65 each in your size.
Or you can just give the car to me and I'll worry about all the little details, lol I still want to have one of these for a 3rd car. By the time I can actually buy one, they will all be turned into spec miata's. Argggg!! /shakes fist at sky
Sweet, that's what I wanted to hear. From my limited search last night, I couldn't tell if it was easy to access the rain rail or not. I guess I'll have to monkey with it tonight after the wife gets home. And thanks for the tire suggestions. I've considered the Ziex as I've run those before and thought they were pretty good for an all-season. And yes, the Pole Positions are always another great tire. 3rik, I'll look into the G0009s; never heard of them before.
:laugh: I'm trying to fight the urge as much as possible to keep this as stock as I can. The last thing I need is yet another money pit, lol. And I don't want to start racing it because I'm 100% certain that I'll really want to dump money into it. :biggrin:
Yeah, I would probably have to turbo it, get some wider wheels on the back and have fun. Then reality punches me in the face I already have 1 money pit lol
I have Goodyear Eagle GTII tires on my car and have gotten 3 good summers of beat out of them. The rain rail is a PITA to replace, make sure that you have a good rivet gun, good rivets and washers also, I would highly consider getting a top with the rail attached from Robbins. If you don't do that, buy your rain rail off ebay, I got mine there and it was just fine. I would highly recomment making sure that the crank cam pylly has been looked at. and crank the timing up, better performance and I still get 34MPG
my yoko avs es100s were great summer tires for my integra, i got a good three summers outa them. good in the rain and fairly sticky.
Hmmm....I might have to rethink the tires thing on this car now. There is a crapload of tread on them; perhaps I'll just get them rebalanced since they REALLY need it done and then just live with it. I just unmounted my set on the WRX and they are in pretty rough shape. One of them is corded, lol. It looks like I'll be getting new tires for the wagon instead now, lol.
+100000000000 These are what i have on right now. these tires PWN water/rain/wet pavement. also they have pretty dang good dry grip. first winter is good with them, second winter = scary. i have over 60k on mine right now, and i starting on summer 3. I am planning on 1 more summer (15k+) miles on em. plus they are cheap.
Ok, I got a chance to look at the rain rail today. Water is coming in where the rail meets the chassis. I put a good bead of silicone around the entire area and I'm praying that it will work (but I doubt it, lol). The rail seemed to be made of a soft rubber material -- isn't the stock one made from plastic? Also, the top was connected to the rail by bolts and not rivets. If I undo the bolts and pull back the top, will I be able to access more of the rail?
> I put a good bead of silicone around the entire area without seeing a picture or something it is hard to tell. The way it is put together you'll probably just be pushing the leak down the line, so to speak. You don't really want to be sealing a metal part to a plastic part, or anything like that. The only way I think it would help is if there were an actual hole or crack in the rain rail itself (so you'd be bonding rubber to rubber) > The rail seemed to be made of a soft rubber material -- isn't the stock one made from plastic? yeah, probably got a replacement with the new top. > Also, the top was connected to the rail by bolts and not rivets. As I recall, it goes together something like this (section cut) green are bolts. Orange are rivets - or should be. They need to be somewhat flush with the rail. If they are bolts the head and/or nut won't allow the whole contraption to fit together very tightly and I imagine there would be leaks. So you would need to pull out the green bolts and metal trim to see the rivets. Maybe that is what you did, I don't know.... The green bolts are supposed to be super low torque - maybe 7ft/lbs? - which is like less than hand-tight. I guess if they are too tight it will bind and you'll get gaps in other areas. I'll try to find my notes tomorrow.
Ok, sorry for the crappy pic but I just took this in the dark. The view is from basically looking straight back towards the rear of the car. Where I'll see leaks is where the bead of caulk is. After looking at your pics, I'm beginning to realize how the thing is put together now. ...and unfortunately I'm guessing that the rail has a crack or two that I can't see in the bottom and then letting the water out from under where I put caulking. doh.
yeah, the silicon is probably just going to move the problem somewhere else. All the water needs to stay inside the rubber part. Take the bolts and the metal pieces off and you can see better if the rubber is damaged anywhere. Even after I got mine replaced and reassembled, I took the hose to it, and there was still water coming in (granted, much less...) I had to play with loosening and tightening the bolts and tugging on the rubber part until it was just right. So that may be all you need. It is a frustrating process, for sure...
Yup, that is my plan of action for tomorrow. Is it possible that the rail is perfectly fine and that the rear "lip" (by the plastic trim in your pic) of the rail is pinched somewhere allowing water to come in from behind? Again, thanks for the help so far. :biggrin:
could be. I don't really remember how that back side worked, I think it was a big rubber flap (bigger than what I showed) that the back edge of the rain rail tucked under. With all the bolts and rivets going through the rain rail, there are plenty of holes built into it that could allow water to get through if they are stetched funny or too loose/too tight. But that is just a trial and error thing. Check your trunk too; water that comes in will find its way to the lowest part of the trunk. If it has been pooling there you'll probably see some surface rust. Not a big deal but you can get an idea how long the problem has been going on.
Ok, I got a chance to take some stuff apart earlier today. It looks like my leaks were coming from a few small cracks on the backside of the rain rail -- and thus the water would appear to come in from under it (where I originally put some caulk). I only got a chance to pull the center rail section out and not the sides because I got spooked by the dark clouds overhead, lol. Anyways, the cracks have been filled with caulk and now I'm keeping my fingers crossed. Otherwise, it doesn't look like that hard of a job to replace the entire rail. I'd just need to find a rivet gun, I guess (and some spare time).
I think that duetto top even comes with rivets of the appropriate length. I couldn't find any of my printouts/notes, probably tossed them trying to banish the memory of the whole episode. (I also replaced the carpet, which means removing the entire dash to do it right...) The torque values for those bolts should be on miata.net somewhere. There is even a specific order in which you are supposed to tighten them. The rail probably comes with that info too. Good luck...
