Yeah, it is something I picked up from working at afton. They have the instructors do clinics to learn to ride and teach better. Tweaking out the feet really helps with a good snowboard stance. I really can ride a lot lower without effort. It makes a huge difference when carving and making clean solid turns. It also helps with riding switch. I find that I longboard this way too.... I used to ride 15* and 0* (or 5*).... I did this for about 15 years. I swapped out my stance about 4 years ago and I ride so much better. It really makes a difference once you understand how to technically ride... flexion, extention, stance ... things I thought I knew but really never did.
Here is an example I used to use when teaching... Stand with your legs straight, shoulder width apart and bend your knees, notice you limitations on bending your knees (they get tight) and how your center of gravity moves off axis when you get lower. Almost like you butt is dipping down. It is harder to not fold at the waistline. This 100% affects how your board responds and the transfer of your weight and control. Now tweak out the feet to a 20 - 30* angle equally. Notice that your knees have rotated out. Now when you bend your knees go out at an angle with your toes but your core/center of gravity is much more stable. It's a very solid stance. If doing it right it sort of looks like a horse stance for all you old school kung-fu nuts. Another example that we use with new riders is like a baseball catcher (similar to) Do the same test and simulate going on your toe edge. straight legs = you roll on your toes a lot more, more pressure body feels sort of jerky/unnatural ducked out feet = more big toe, you can swing you waist a bit more and keep your center over the board. It's easier to "give it" to the snow. When going on the toe edge think about "giving it" to the snow..... that motion = smooth transition, more edge and board control. There is a ton that goes into good lines... but above is a basic example. Trust me, 19+ seasons riding and I still have a lot to learn.
From my experience, you don't need to go to the extremes you are suggesting, just a few degrees will give the effect you are describing. ...and to clarify, it is not, by far, the best stance for carving. You want to carve, both feet are forward as it puts the weight further forward on the board. Although, considering the crazy extremes the board manufacturers are going to with camber profiles it may not be a good thing to try a proper carve on some of these boards. Wait! Nobody carves anymore, anyway. ....coming from 25 years of experience including a couple of seasons competing (back when competing meant all disciplines: GS, Slopestyle (similar to BoarderX), and HP). Craig Kelly 171 Slopestyle FTW! I even won a couple of HP competitions riding that board!
Most current teaching styles would disagree with you. However, carving is not the GS/Race Snowboarding you are thinking of. Your lack of knowledge on this subject is pretty obvious. Carving is defined by a specific transition style from one edge to the other. When someone carves the transition is edge flat edge with a minor amount of time/space between the edge to edge transition. Carving correctly requires the back and front foot to take the same path in the snow. People who don't carve would be doing Skid Turns. A skidded turn is very popular in the snowboarding community, not due to preference but due to poor form and understanding of snowboarding. Your skidded turn is still going edge to edge but skidding in and out of the transition. This is easy to see when looking at the lines in the snow. Your typical carve will be similar to an S shape with the flat being in the transition and only sharp edge lines in the "loops" of the S shape. This allows the board to ride at an angle and also allows the rider to pop out of the turn. This is easier to show vs type but here is the general idea. Going into a edge the front foot starts the transition with the rear foot quickly following. The riders stance flexes (knees bend more) absorbing the energy and using the flex patters in the board. The edge locks the snow and will carry the rider through the transition. Coming out of the edge the rider's body extends with the flex of the board to the flat and the next transition. There is a lot that goes into it technically to do it correctly, but the pop from the turn is like none other. Carving on a park board is a lot of fun, allows more control and you're using your snowboard how it is designed to be used. There is a reason that snowboards are shaped they way that they are. The skidded turn can still look like an S, however you will notice a lot of wash out going into and out of the "loop" of the S. The key thing to notice when riding is that your feet don't follow the same path. Most people this will be the rear foot sliding out a lot more. You can see the skidded turn for a number of reasons. The most common reason is people steer with their back leg or shoulders. Other reasons can be due to poor stance... center of mass, folding at the waist, locking knee or knees, leaning too far forward, leaning too far backwards, shoulders not in line with the board.... the list goes on. Each person is different and most of us that have been riding for 10+ years have been doing it wrong. Competitions mean nothing! Actually, i would believe you are in comps... i know lots of good snowboarders... but most of them cannot teach. Just because you can hit jumps and rails does not mean you understand the dynamics of using your snowboard. It just means you can hit park. I know your kind, I run D-Team, Rock-N-Rides and deal with instructors and friends similar to you every year. I am willing to put money on the fact that you could whip me in the park, but your stance and form sucks for snowboarding. If you want to go into this further I am more than happy to ride with you this year and point out a few things.
Interesting points about stance setup. For reference I ride right around 18 front and -15 back. current setup as follows. Boots: 32 Lashed Board: Gnu park pickle (156) Bindings: Forum Shaka
That's a very popular setup. My wife rides 15° x 15° and has way better form than i do. It's all personal preference, but some duck is good.
...and you have ZERO clue about my knowledge of snowboarding....that is all I will say at this point. edit: Actually, I lied. Let me quote a famous 'carver' from back in the day. "You carve, you carve, you carve, even if its icy." (though with a very thick accent) Can someone name the movie?
Annie and I are going riding at Troll Saturday. Just look for the SUBARU parked in back. We will either be there tailgating, in the bar, or on the hill. More of a chance for the first 2. OMG SUBARU
I 100% agree, I know nothing about you or your experience. I think you missed the point. Carving is NOT GS or Hard Boot Snowboarding. Carving is when your toe and heel follow the same path in the snow. It is how you turn, use your edges and the technology in the snowboard. Vs, skid turning or pivot turning. FYI - a ducked out stance like I am talking about allows riders to spin and ride switch better. Again, if you ever want to chat about it or ride I am more than happy to show you a few things that you maybe did not know.
Afton is open this week. (Facebook) Afton Alps The snowmaking crew has made a lot of snow, and we are open! We will be open Tuesday through Thursday from 3pm to 9pm each day. Hours for the weekend will be determined in the next few of days, the weather may determine our schedule. Chair 4 Nancy's Nursery will be open. We will have 3 Features a Mailbox, Long Box, and Short Box Lift Tickets will be $20.00 per person any age today through Thursday. Come on out and FUN in the snow!
27-30d front and 0-(10) rear. Old man. Ride switch only when necessary. Have been riding since late '80s after years of slalom skiing. Love to carve and surf t3h pow out west. Now prefer modern carve skis on Midwestern ice rinks. I have a bad ass Donek full-custom, personalized, 169cm board (< the cost of a major brand) with Burton C60 (carbon fiber) bindings. If the snow/slope is right I can carve 360d trenches in soft boots. Winning.
I didn't know that people as old as you can snowboard. Thought that it was a "young peen" sport? Lol I prefer carving the pow out west over the midwestern ice rinks(doesn't hurt my old man bones when i fall). Went to Afton a couple of years ago and decided to sell my board and bindings because of it. We should have a senior citizen Subie meet for us old furts over a hot mug of Metamucil?
Last year was nice. Afton has put 10million in snow making over the past 3 years. All new pipes, water pumps, and tons of new snow guns. I road 2+ days every week last year and only had a few ice days. I would say 3, IIRC. Otherwise the snow was awesome. Either way, you can always have fun.
Yep, don't let the brown grass fool you. We had great snow last year at Welch. Hardly any ice days. With the weather right now, opening weekend may not be epic, (any riding is better than none) but give us a week or so of good cold weather and the snow will be good! They've also added a bunch of new guns/pumps/lines this year to be able to cover everything much faster.
just went for the first time yesterday... have to say the snow was crap but i am getting back in the groove with things. on the plus side of things learned how to 360 finally.
Welch Village is having a cyber-Monday deal. All single day lift passes are $30.00. Regular is $49.00. Passes can be purchased online in any quantity and are good anytime throughout the 2012/2013 season. Welch Village
I was out at Afton yesterday trying a new setup. They had the one run under the main chair open along with the lift on the bunny hill. I took a few falls on the last box and ended up breaking my binding causing me to head home early.
went out to wild mountain on saturday. they were just pumping out snow!!! i guess its time to buy a season pass (college discount!!)
I would, but I'll be out most of Sunday. Vs? Ticket prices are pretty much the same across the metro.
About one hour into the season, i broke my new boots. The BOA system got out of wack, first trapped my foot in, then busted off.
I got out to Welch for the first time last week on Wednesday. Although there were only two runs open at the time, the snow was surprisingly nice! I skipped out for most of the year last season, but as Glen mentioned, the snow was still pretty good. I plan to make it out frequently this year and get the full value from my season pass!
Bummer. In other news, good ol' fashioned lace-thingies still work. My boots are going on 10yo, but all the new fandangled tech seems sketchy.
10 years on boots? You don't ride a lot or they are broken down to nothing? The new tech in snowboarding rocks. Toe strap bindings, auto bindings, speed laces, BOA systems... Plus all the new board designs/shapes. You can't go wrong with the new tech. Yeah, my old pair was BOA. I loved them too. It is so nice to be able to get your boots as tight as you want on the fly. However, i went to get another pair and they also busted off. They broke the exact same way. They switch from a metal cable this year to a fabric blend. It looks like it was getting wound under the spindle... Don't know if it's due to the cable type. Looks like a new brand for me. They had a set of north waves that were in my size, i am going to try them on tonight. I was holding out for another set of K2, my buddy thought he had an 11 at home (K2 rep) but they were 12s. Too bad, i am going to miss the BOA setup.
I hope they ride the same. I guess I'll find out Thursday. Initial impressions are good... But you never really know till you ride them.
Thursday I will only be out for 2 hours, I should be fine. I hope that will set me up for Sunday, which will be most of the day. Oh.... Also Rock N Ride details for Afton THE WINTER ORACLES HAVE SPOKEN! Here is your Rock N Ride schedule for the season. December 22nd (Park) January 19th (Park) February 9th (skier/boarder-cross event) March 16th - Spring Fling Final!! (Special Park) Rejoice and pray to Father Winter!
Going to out ride soon. I am hoping it stays warmer tonight and doesn't freeze up on me. I guess we'll find out. Anyone else riding this weekend? I plan to be out most of the day on Sunday as well.
WHOA! Vail just picked up Afton. The bigwigs at the top say that big improvements are coming! Sweet, I guess I work for Vail now. http://www.benzinga.com/news/12/12/...s-in-midwest-afton-alps-in-minnesota-and-moun
