http://www.cnn.com/2008/US/02/15/university.shooting/index.html#cnnSTCVideo Looks like its a trait now. Kinda scary. I dont know what you guys think about Gun policy but i think there should be just a bit more control to whom they sell the guns. I mean at least run a medical history.
I don't think "who they are selling the guns to" has any merit in these types of cases. Most of these kids don't just go out and purchase guns for the sake of doing so, and a lot of "psychopaths" are able to hide their illness for long, long periods of time. It is the act of hiding it that eventually breaks their spirits and causes them to act out like this. Yeah it is stupid and sucky, but so are the methods put in place to prevent such catastrophes. I doubt that putting metal detectors into the schools will solve anything (humans are involved - humans will get lazy and eventually the security will be more lax after the hubbub has died down) and I doubt that putting stricter checks in place for people buying guns is going to cause anything more than heartache for the legitimate gun buyer. Not everyone who buys a gun is going to go out and murder someone. This is why I hate the media. These things happen, it is the natural order of things, but when you involve news outlets, everything gets blown out of proportion. Take, for example, the cases of teachers having sex with students: they are being "found out" all over the country, at least once a day I hear this story, but it's the 'big' issue right now that people are reading about, so we're going to write about any idiot that does it. People are shooting people all over the country, one school shooting is nothing compared to a gang fight in brooklyn, but we hear about the school shootings more because people feel schools are a "safe haven" of sorts, a sanctuary, and this blows that feeling completely out of the water. A little less so as time goes on, if we had one a week for a year, by this time next year nobody would care and people would take their OWN precautions to prevent such a thing. I guess what I'm saying is that making the laws stricter is not going to solve anything. Just because something is an "issue" at the time doesn't mean we should just write a law for it and hope the problem goes away. Sort of ... well ..you're damned if you do, and you're damned if you don't, isn't it?
Mental illness is one of the checks conducted in a background check when applying for a license to purchase firearms. Unfortunately, the guys selling guns out of the backs of their vans will not conduct the same gauntlet of checking, so this point really becomes moot. If someone wants a gun badly enough, there are ways to get a hold of them.
Did not know that. But you are right its not going to stop anyone. I have no idea what can really help in this situation. Metal detectors will not do much help either. Maybe better education about violence and stuff?
exactly, all these people running around blaming education when really, in my opinion its the crazy people that think everyone should be a medicated zombie that never disrupts or asks too many questions, or just on medication for anything mood or mentally related imo. wait, teachers made up that disease already, I believe they call it attention deficite disorder..... the most made up disease of all kind, as it seems to disappear outside of school..... hmmmmm maybe the student could care less about the topic of the day at school? sorry for the rant, somewhat off topic but I think its a start.
yeah ... ANOTHER one :roll: I am sure that everything that has been said in here was already said in another gun thread. Makes me wonder if people are pushing buttons and Tim, ADD does NOT disappear out of school. People grow up, but they can still have ADD.
I suppose you are right aegis, but I have been told all my life by teachers from primary school on up that I had add. I have been "tested" more times than I remember and never been diagnosed. I guess thats just how it is for me then lol as for the guns topic, its completely irrelevant weather you think so or not. PERIOD
I love my gun. I sleep with it at night. Sometimes, when I'm lonely... I like to put a wig on it and pretend that its name is Gunnifer. I like to think that she loves me too. She loves me too...
This Is My Rifle! There Are Many Like It, But This One Is Mine! My Rifle Is My Best Friend! It Is My Life! I Must Master It As I Must Master My Life! My Rifle Without Me Is Useless, Without My Rifle I Am Useless!
have any self estem issues?.... i hope you dont try and ya know....get it on with your gun. seeing how much you actualy love it haha ya know the saying though "this is my rifle, this is my gun. this is for fighting, this is for fun"
Oh yeah I wish we could just have a nice thread about guns where people show off their guns like they do their cars, and nobody turns it into a "omg you has guns you must want to HURT PEOPLE" thread. One where we can see them and go "oh wow that's a sexy piece of metal you got there." You know, a civil discussion about guns. Is that possible here? I wanna see what people here have anyway, I know Shorten probably has a gun.
I won't take pictures of my gun and post them here for you sycophants... She's mine, all mine... You wouldn't understand our love!
I went to the NRA show in St. Louis last year and it was quite a treat. Got Gunny's autograph, saw Tom Selleck, and got to handle every gun from every manufacturer side by side. Comparison shopping rules! :biggrin:
Taras, do us all a favor and stop making these threads where you call people out for what their beliefs are. . OBVIOUSLY people here aren't going to shoot people up, so why fill their heads full of this stuff? Don't you think that we're already aware of what is going on out there? Anyone can open up a web page and go to google news and see it. We already know what others here think, so why make another thread for it? Like I said above, it seems like button pushing. If you wish to discuss gun control and all that stuff, make ONE thread dedicated to it and keep updating it with your new stories. You make it out to appear that none of us have compassion, and I'm sure we do, but since ONE person cannot change the world, it's best left to it's own mechanisms. If we wish to discuss how much we love our guns (and I believe that all the "I love my gun" stuff in this thread is SARCASTIC) then we should have the right to do so without being made to feel like a bad guy because obviously we must be just as terrible as the people who perpetrate these acts. :roll: I'm sorry that 5 people got shot. It's sad, yes. I'm not going to lose sleep over it at this point because *I* can't personally change it. I'd feel exactly the same way if it happened here. What is done is done and can't be undone. And if someone opens fire in the Target center, I'm still going to use the skyway for getting around Minneapolis. It's not that I don't care - but rather that I'm focusing my energy elsewhere because if I spend too much time caring about what other people are doing with their god-given free will, it will drive me insane. Also, just because we're Americans doesn't mean we believe in all the laws and stuff surrounding our "constitutional rights" You are not going to provoke a revolution just by stirring up some car nuts and I think that you're pretty smart, and a lot of the barrier we have when talking to you, Taras, is because of well hidden sarcasm. A thread like this is just asking for it. Also, hurt feelings ... a thread like this is asking for those too. Hurt feelings for no reason. I'm not attacking you, or trying to, I just think that in your quest to discover what it truly means to be an American citizen, you're running into a lot of self-made hurdles.
Crazy people are everywhere. There's nothing you can do about it. Even presidents get shot. Just like driving you car, you have to be paying attention. And when you see a gun, you run.
see this? THIS is what makes me happy. There needs to be more of these types of stories. Too bad you won't hear much about the "goodness" of people being discussed in the media. http://www.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/meast/02/13/iraq.wheelchairs/index.html but what makes me sad is that nobody will clean up the mess (so to speak) of the school shootings in a constructive manner that would actually help. Nobody wishes to take the time to assist others because of fear of their own safety, when it's much easier to just throw money at a charity and consider yourself a good person. This one guy is an exception. They are always "exceptions" to the rule. We're all so paranoid, as a race, in this day and age. Ugh. I feel old.
Just for this post, I'm going to go out and buy 5 guns and give them to angry, unwashed highschool kids. The real unwanted types that get picked on. People getting killed by guns has **** SQUAT to do with another person's love for guns. I love guns, and you know what? My love for guns has nothing to do with someone shooting up a school. Not only is your reading comprehension terrible, but your ability to make connections between different ideas is terrible. What does some guy shooting 5 people have anything to do with blackozone's love of his guns? Anything? Anything at all? Please, tell me how if blackozone didn't love guns how it would have stopped the shooting from happening at that school? Sometimes I think you say blatently stupid things merely to piss off the people around here that have common sense. I want to believe you aren't as stupid as you seem on the internet, but honestly, I'm starting to think I was wrong to give you an inch. And you can blah blah blah all day about people being entitled to their opinions and whatever, but your opinion here is completely and totally retarded and devoid of any sort of relevance. You are one stupid post away from being on my ignore list with jakeachy.
I'll throw in on this. My own personal belief is that we need more guns in the hands of the right people, and opening up the boundaries on where you're allowed to carry. Any place that I've ever seen that says "We ban guns on these premises" is just advertising the fact that they're a potential free fire zone for anyone who wants to start shooting up a place. Do you really think we'd see something like this if they knew there was a good chance that the classroom they wanted to start shooting up or the dorm building, etc had people armed as well? It'd be more of a deterrent than what there is now. If someone wants to go somewhere to start shooting, a sign is not going to be a barrier. All that they're guaranteed is a lot of unarmed targets running around. The process to purchase a firearm is different from state to state, however in MN there is no 3 day waiting period to purchase a firearm. That's because you have to apply for a permit to purchase a firearm, which is a full background check done by the local PD or Sheriffs dept and includes a check of whether or not you've ever been committed to a mental health institution or treated for mental illness. The background check can take up to 2-4 weeks. Once you pass that you are issued a permit to purchase which is valid for one year. The process to gain a concealed carry permit is a bit harder, in that you have to take a classroom course which includes a shooting test, and then submit paperwork to the local sheriffs office. They will do their own background check and at the end of 30 days you are issued your permit, unless the background check gets flagged. One thing that should be noted, when the new permit rules came out there was not the feared "stampede" to get a carry permit. There are around 30k carry permit holders in the state, and in all this time there has been one shooting crime involving a permit holder, the drunk who got tossed out of Nye's and came back and shot the bouncer. I'd say that's a better percentage than the non permit/illegal gun owners. The people who actually take the time to do the classes are respectful of what it means to carry a gun in public. It doesn't mean that you're Wyatt Earp, it doesn't give you the right to pull that gun for any reason you see fit. There are very, very specific criteria that have to be met in order for deadly force to be used. However, I think that in cases like this or the mall shooting in NE, etc that lives could have been saved had a permit holder been there and able to take action. There are real world cases of permit holders saving lives because they engaged an armed assailant and took them down or were able to keep them from killing anyone else. One of the most famous cases happened in Texas, where a man going through a divorce loaded up on body armor and took an AK to the courthouse and shot his wife and her attorney on the steps of the courthouse. He was opening fire on other people when a carry holder shot him multiple times. However, his body armor stopped the rounds and he shot and killed the carry holder. Because he was wounded he tried to get away at that point and was subsequently killed by law enforcement. The man who put his life on the line saved lives and gave his own helping to protect the people in that area. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tyler_courthouse_shooting Here are a few more cases: http://jacklewis.net/weblog/archives/2005/08/concealed_carry.php http://www.zianet.com/web/gunstudy.htm http://www.burtonblog.com/view.cfm?post=1166 http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/local/250101_wounded29.html http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles/ayoob65.html http://www.aware.org/success/jeansstory.shtml These are just a few examples. Massad Ayoob has written several books and articles on the subject of self defense that involve real world situations.
