Any reason I should be looking catted DP?

I'm close to buying a DP for my STi...but can't decide on catted vs. catless. I've been looking at the Invidia v2 or v3 catless and the helix catted. What are the pros and cons of going catless? So far it seems as though the car might stink a bit, might be a little louder, catless might yield a little more hp and is not as environmentally friendly, but certainly cheaper...am I missing something?

I know there are other threads about downpipes, I'm just trying to get pros and cons here. I was set on catless up until recently...but not fully convinced that I want to go catted either (due to cost and slight loss of power).

Help would be appreciated.

Mike

 

You about covered it. Pretty much everything I've read on IWSTI says about 5hp and 10tq improvement with stock turbo.

BTW, 1 catless car puts out about the same emissions as 9 cars with cats. I'm not a tree hugger by any means but to me it's just not worth the benefit.

 

I went catless. I wish I would have went with a catted DP though. The car is a little louder than I like and smells pretty bad I think. When I park the car and walk away from it my whole driveway smells. In the summer with the windows down you can smell it at stop lights. The worst is in a parking ramp like at block E and you are waiting to leave. It chokes you out. I always get questions from people too. The high flow cats flow so well that I am switching this spring.

My project car (Merkur XR4Ti) is even worse. =) I removed the egr, the cats, and routed the PCV system to vent down stream of the car. So it has no emissions whatsoever. I plan to clean it up this summer as well.

I think going catless is like keeping the a/c in your car. Sure it adds weight and 'robs' horsepower but it sure is nice to have.

 

I would never go catted cuz you are paying more for less performance. Yes you will have more noise but I have a catless Invidia v3 on my STI and I love the sound. The performance difference with the AP and catback I already had was pretty amazing. I would also recommend that if you order it from someone either have it coated by one the guys locally before you put it on or have it drop shipped from the vendor to Jethot or Swaintech. I also used Thermotec copper exhaust wrap on top of the Jethot coating. Sounds like a lot of extra work but I think every little bit helps. Just my .03.

 

I went with the catted DP (TXS from Oakos). Uncatted reeks. I don't think there is a power difference betwen the two.

 

I have a catless cobb set up that i used for about 2 months lemme know if you want a price for it. its a TBE

 

From what I've seen and heard there is only a 2-4% hp difference between the two.

 

thanks everyone...this helps.

 

Go Catless, cause i got a nice Invidia DP for sale for $265, Divorced wastegate and you got it, catless!!

 

^^^Great price/part and no waiting around for shipping it would be mine if I didn't already have it.

Actually you should think about picking up his catback too if thats the route you were still thinking about going.

 

I think you just got lightheaded! :laugh:

My advice is to ride with somebody who has an uncatted car. You should smell fuel. Then decide if that is the setup you want. If you have a signicant other, I'll tell you what she'll say...

But notice all these people selling their uncatted DPs???

 

Kind of a highjack but, what is the price to get a DP coated?

As far as DP price, I went with the Megan Racing uncatted DP mated up to my Apexi GT from there back. Super cheap and hasn't failed me for almost a year now. Nice belmouth setup and the construction looks sound to me. Take a look if you curious and on a budget.

I didn't notice the difference in smell and my wallet tells me it was worth saving 3 or 400 dollars on the cat every time I get in the car.

 

One of the members daughters said it best on here

"that car smells fast!!!"

 

Day in and day out would get old. But maybe I'm just old.

 

I think that's a weak argument. We're talking about a car that's capable of putting 300+ hp to the ground. Who gives a flying eff about an additional 2% (at best?) hp gain. The cost-benefit just isn't there. Plus, the expense of a TBE is in the $1000+ range and depending on EM, an additional $200-600 to see the actual gain. What's an extra $200 when we're talking about a $25,000+ car with (in the end) another ~$2,000-5,000 worth of mods?

Unless we're talking about a dedicated track car, I'm not seeing any compelling evidence to run catless other than some (marginal) expense differences. You gotta pay to play.

 

Most definitely loosing my warranty was the biggest issue I had to think about

I dont care if I smell gas/exhaust since I probably smell worse at least it covers me up when i have a chick in the car!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

if you have to ask about a catted d/p then you know nothing about subarus, and you also are a hippie

 

ROFFLE that made my night. Also every time you eat a steak a hippie's hacky sack goes down the gutter!!!!!!

 

Just my two cents here. I agree with bummpy and you basically won't lose a noteworthy amount of hp between catless dp and a catted dp. It's all personal preference. Do you not care about the emissions, like max performance, and enjoy the smell of exhaust, then go with it. If you're the opposite with most of that (of course you want more performance) and don't mind paying a bit more for a cat, then go with that. Regardless of all this hippy crap, you're the one who paid for your car and you should get what you'll be satisfied with

 

catless v3 divorced - spt catback...

I dont' have any issues inside the car.... period.
little drone grumble, but nothing 2 notches on the stereo won't drown out.

it's as not as loud as you think, and if your local.... i'll be more then happy to take you for a ride around the block to see if it's something you want.

 

the smells are less than a lot of catted cars driving on the roads... the only porblem you have is if they start testing statewide for emissions, (which I may say is in discussions)... it is still a federal LAW which you can recieve a $10,000 or so fine.... but the chances of a federal inspector pulling you over in this state is pretty slim....

so basically it comes down to what you want... with an STi some say they have issues with wastegate flutter, but there is ways around all that too...

if you are going to drop $2000-$5000 more in mods then yes, spend the extra $$$ get a nice qaulity catted DP.. rememeber though if the cat does breakdown, you will either have to replace the DP or GUT it anyways.. ha h ha

 

Yeah, thanks for responding...helps me tremendously.

Thanks to everyone else who actually gave some helpful advice.

 

Catless-
- awful smell
- burnt bumper above exhaust
- extra 3 HP! Noes way! (More/less depending on how much power you make)
- Puts out 12 times the toxic emissions of a catted car
- $100 cheaper
Catted-
- If it came down to an emssions test you could pass unless the inspector is a d-bag
- no smell
- no burnt bumper
- extremely high flowing, creates very little backpressure asks only a measly 3hp on a stage 2 car avg.
- helps reduce/eliminate boost creep by keeping some backpressure. ( a VERY good thing)
-Keeps your hippie gf happy!

Personally, I ran a catless downpipe for two weeks until I got sick of the smell, my bumper was melting, I could literally see little kids passing out as I drove by, and I was getting mad boost creep. I swapped in a helix high flow catted downpipe in and VOILA! no boost creep and I'm one happy man. If you have some crazy ass 600whp fire breathing race car that needs the extra power then fine, but for your dd who are you kidding? **** if you can't afford a catted one I'll help you out.

 

what the heck does this have to do with catless.... I have catless and not once in 2.5yrs has it burnt my bumper... can you say ****TY designed exhaust.... or ricer style that isnt far enough out..... nothing to do with catless... you could say it is from more heat without cats, but the fact that cats work FROM the heat in the exhaust then that nullifies the argument...

oh yeah... 2.5yrs no cats and NOT ONCE have I smelt the rotten egg smell... may wanna make sure it wasnt that TOYOTA PRIUS (hippy car) with the convertors in front of you making all the smell....

 

The wide design of a catalytic converter provides a larger surface area exposed to ambient air, which allows much more heat to dissipate before the tailpipe as opposed to a straight 2.5" or 3" diameter pipe. The inside of the converter is a honeycomb design, which also acts as a heat sink. Plus, as you astutely pointed out, catalytic converters use heat energy from the exhaust to function. Heating up the catalyst substrate thereby reduces the amount of heat energy reaching the tailpipe.

Unless of course you have some sort of magic exhaust that the laws of thermodynamics don't apply to. :laugh:

 

I'm not so sure hippies buy turbo subarus but apparently a-holes do! zing!

You should read this article. There's all kinds of ways to be the f4st0r on your way to Firestone for cheap!

http://www.sportcompactcarweb.com/features/0208_technical_assistance_program/

Going catless (and its not just for Subarus..hehe) has some compromises. It depends on what you want to do with the car. For a daily driver I found that getting a catless DP isn't a great fit. I have PLENTY of power that I probably won't even notice teh slight reduction in flow. If I was building a drag car, track car, or dyno queen I would totally go catless. It's the same reason I have progressive rate lowering springs on the car instead of some coilovers or uber stiff springs and shocks that will make it drive like a brick s$#%house. I can live with not having that .2g of lateral acceleration while on a roadtrip or going to work.

And now for my favorite hippie joke:
Why couldn't the life guard save the hippie?

He was too far out!

 

noted. but why pay more for less hp

 

Smell.

But that's why I said he should check out an uncatted car. wrxboy2003 is the only person who claims to have a non-smelling car. Even walloftvs wanted to sell his uncatted and run cats. I think he told me the smell was giving him headaches. Either that or all the Mountain Dew...

 

I'm considering it. So there.

<--- tired of a stinky car

I think that the only types of applications where the butt dyno will register a difference is on a car with a much larger turbo. Then it would probably be a good idea to go/stay catless. Stock tiny turbos = catted ok, imho.

 

maybe mine does have a smell occasionally... but I work in a garage everyday, so oil, and fuel smells are nothing... besides I am a rotory freak so exhaust smells etc dont get to me...

you want modified cars, then get used to bad smells.. and the best of them is burning rubber.. ha ha ha

 

I like the suggestion towards the bottom where they remove all of the sheet metal...that could compensate for the addition of a cat

I think I just have to ride in a catless car to see, hear and smell the difference.

I've driven behind a catless STi in the fun run and didn't so much mind the smell (don't know long term how I'd feel about it though).

 

start your car on a cold day like a mn winter and the first 5-10 minutes of warmup time is all catless, they have to warm up before they do anything which is why your car stinks in the morning but doesnt when you get home.

I could smell wrxboy2003's car when he took me in it but his windows were down to listen to his glory, the smell was just a bonus.

i am still planning on going catless this spring, mostly cuz its certainly cheaper for me to get nathan to make it up himself then order up racing cats. im inticed by this bottom line to increase the gerth of my pipe and more hp. i have alergies too...

 

As stated above you did follow me in the fun run and as you know we had a chance to get on it pretty good. Ethics of going catless aside if you are wondering about the smell I really hardly notice it ever. In fact the rare time I do I enjoy it kinda like walking the pits of a superbike race :yumyum: or any racetrack for that matter. My wife is the worlds pickiest person when it comes to smells and she has not once complained about the smell. No matter what you pick the smile on your face with your new found power will make you forget you went through so much trouble deciding. or maybe its the fumes that help you forget hmmmm. I vote catless.

 

Okay, first off you're dumb. Going catless allows unburnt gas/vapors to flow through the exhaust. Ever seen flames after someone shifts? Yeah that is where the burnt bumper comes into play. Obviously it doesn't happen on EVERY car that is catless but it is a very widespread thing. People get the shocker decals a lot of times to cover it up. I'm suprised you aren't shooting flames with your mad tyte BOV running rich after shifts rolling on some blinging 19's.

Catless cars stink...end of story. Maybe your car is just running really lean or something so it doesn't smell AS BAD but it is extremely common.

 

Dude the flames don't melt the exhaust. The canister size and location in relation to the bumper melts it. I've seen cars at firestone with burnt bumpers that still had the stock dp. btw before calling Nathan dumb you should probably consider the fact he works on and builds custom exhaust for a living. Also Nathan has the gfb bov which is an adjustable 50-50 bov which was installed on his car when he got tuned.

 

I really do like the smell, having ridden 2 strokers and sportbikes for years it reminds me of the good times when there is snow on the ground. This is a very strange thread, people talking massive crap about some stupid cats.

 

ok cumwad.. you call me dumb but I own an exhaust shop.... why dont you go back to Nasioc where you and your fellow OT neanderthals can sit around inspecting the spot where your genitalia should be.. you are on your seventh post and already being a jerkwad to people....

woo am I supposed to be upset cause you dont like my BOV (which is recirculating and not too noisey) and I have 19's on my car.. my choice not yours... just like your parents had a choice to wear a condom or not!! a]bad choice from what I see...

pss you illiterate boob tyte is spelt tight!!!!!! or is that just you trying to act cool ..... FAILED DUMBA55!!!

 

Yeah, how much to get mine declawed? I guess a declawed cat is a gutted dp?

:laugh:

 

Very professional. Sounds like you brought Nasioc here.

 

+1 not even a scratch on the rear bumper of his car, and yes on command he can shoot flames.

and you can melt your bumper with a catted car as well, ie: see anyone who purchased the bosal twin tip exhaust and didnt get the RECCOMENDED long exhaust hangers to go with it....


edit btw i see this thread being closed for ******* commments