i need my ecu put back to stock. or close to it. need this done soon so if anyone want to earn a few sheckles. gimme a call or text (preferably text cause i cant answer much). 952-201-3666 ben
year of the vehicular and make might also be some info that could help u find someone. If its going back to stock anyone with ecu flash and a tactrix that knows how to use it can do it for you if they have a stock map for your car.
^^^Very true, I guess they aren't really "tuning" the car so there are probably many people here that could help.
Since no vehicle description was givin, I'll take a guess that its a 76 nova (x body) so you'll need a scredriver, a 9/16 socket, ratchet and a timing light.
never had a problem with rs. didnt know the guys at all called them up answered all my questions when it came to tuning as well as subaru's in general. i didnt even get any services from them either. great guys over there.
I actually have to, at least in part, agree with this. Over the years I have met several people who have been tuned/dynoed at RS and come back with wild claims of 350, even 400+ on 16g setups and similar impossible numbers. I have never seen people come back with such wildly inflated numbers from MAP or DB. It's possible this has changed, but as of a few years ago people were definitely getting BS numbers from that shop. This is less concrete, but I also got a bad impression when I looked at a car owned by one of their employees. It was talked up as having nice suspension modifications and a good exhaust. It turned out to have completely blown shocks (bounciest car I have ever been in), Massive exhaust leaks at several points and the 1 of 4 spark plugs which was not entirely seized in showed a piston top completely coated in oil. I doubt this was one of the mechanics, but it still worried me to see anyone who worked at a performance shop have such a hugely neglected car and have been so oblivious to basic maintenance (he legitimately did not understand that seized plugs or oil coating an entire cylinder was a serious issue). Anyway, I'm not trying to bad mouth them, but I have seen some less than impressive things related to RS. I, at least, would not trust them to work on my car.
I cannot honestly recall which car this is in question. or which employee. About the bogus number claims, just give me the car/owner info and I will pull up a dyno sheet. Again I cannot recall which car this would be if any at all. I always thought the mustang dyno numbers read less and not the other way around. Now, if the owner decided to tell a different number that what it was dynoed at, that a different story. Say the car was putting out 300 and he/she claims 500-700 then I don't have any control of that. I run this business based on honestly and word of mouth for referrals. I would like some concrete evidence of any complaints if any. Bring them out to a public forum like this one and lets get to the bottom of it. High inflated numbers? I promise you non came from this Mustang dyno. I learned from people who has anything to say, that non has had a personal experience with us or me myself. My customers are my employers, they are the ones keeping us open since 2002. Longer than any other import/performance shops in town. Sorry OP if I got this out of topic. This was brought to my attention and I thought I reply is necessary. Thanks, Ron, Ronnie, Tuner at RS
It's been some time since any of these incidents (I have been too busy with school to network much in the automotive world). I never saw dyno sheets, but at least two people claimed they could produce dyno sheets wit the high claims (none were the sort of situations I would expect them to have the sheets with them). In all cases they were the sort of people that come in wanting big numbers and some shops find it easier/more profitable to show them the numbers they want instead of bursting their bubble. It's not concrete which is why I want to make it clear that these were second hand experiences. Not enough that I can say with any certainty RS made a habit out of falsifying numbers, but it was enough to make me steer clear. Several knowledgeable people on this site have recommended you guys which means something, but whether legitimately earned or not a negative rep can stick. If there is any doubt about a shop it's hard to put your car int heir hands. Again, I'm not trying to bad mouth you guys, but felt it was reasonable to pass on my concerns based on claims from your previous customers. it is possible I just happened to meet several idiots and they are not representative of your shop. I would like to be proven wrong, especially since you're much closer to me than any other shops, lol. I don't remember many great details about the car, but it was a NA Miata with fairly high miles. The owner was a younger kid. He said he worked at RS and I met him at your place after hours. He had his car parked there. My guess based on his age and general demeanor was he was probably a front desk sort of person and not a hands on employee.
A business that only does a good job for friends would quickly be out of business. I'm pretty sure the three shops mentioned so far do a good job for good price or they wouldn't survive. Hearsay and innuendo and Chet. What a great thread.
You are assuming, which is a poor idea. There were a lot of supporting details which I left out to keep my post from running on. In short, I talked to him several times over the course of a couple days deciding whether I wanted to look at it. It was parked at RS the whole time (in front, main spot, not somewhere they would likely ignore a random car parked for sale). He met me there in another car, so it was clear the Miata was parked there. He did not claim to be an employee in some attempt to sound more knowledgeable. He simply mentioned it in an explanation of why the car was parked there. It was only after hours, because I was unable to meet during business hours. You are seeing conspiracies where there are none.
Ronnie and RS have tuned cars for me since 2005. He's always been completely honest and done great work. I have never seen inflated numbers or falsified numbers - that sounds like a load of bs to me based on my experiences and what I know of RS. Their dyno reads low, I have never hit the target numbers I've wanted at RS but if I took it to a higher reading dyno I probably would.
Was this a red Miata parked in the part of the lot closest to 13? If so this is going to get interesting.
It's possible, but I kind of doubt it. I don't like red at all and usually will pass them up unless it's a smoking deal. I have a gut feeling it may have been white, but after 4+ years my memory is hazy. I asked the friend who went with me to look at it and his gut said red so who knows, lol. Did that belong to somebody on here?
So I'm suppose to watch what happens after hours outside my business parking lot? This makes for a bad business practice? I'm done here. Like I said. People who usually have something to say have never dealt with me in person. I'm sorry about your bad used car shopping experience but it has nothing to do with the business I run. I'm not in the business of selling cars. Please let me know of any more bad experience(s) you have personally had with me/us.
anyone who has went to the dyno day at RS can attest it is a heart break dyno there were alot of people that went the 1st year that were disapointed at how low it read compared to their exspectations.
ANYWAYS, let's get back to the thread. I fixed the issue, bad coilpack. Also reverted him back to pump gas.
yes mission completed id like to thank nuke for fixing it and chet for helping me understand the car when he really didnt need to and everyone else for their input. it means a lot to me that there is a community working as a sort of co op helping each other out so we dont get ****ed by dealers and shops and such. also knowing that your here for a reason, you love your subie period. this is my first. i cant wait to get in on some of the activities i have read about on here. cheers guys.
well I can only make an opinion from what is stated.. what else would be done when you dont lay it all out.. you throw out some half assed story adn you want people to even take you the least bit serious???
I'm very sorry I do not keep records of every person I meet in the car scene. You'll just have to take my word for the fact that several people made those claims after dynoing at your place. I highly doubt they were the cars you are thinking of though, since they were (as per the owners descriptions) basic bolt on cars. No cams, no E85, stock intake mani, etc... Generally idiot types who wouldn't know how to squeeze that kind of power out of a 16G if the instructions were laid out in front of them. Clearly didn't have the cash to pay others to build it all either. I do believe you have had people make that kind of power, but it takes real work on a 16G. The stock long block is definitely capable with some head studs and decent tuning. When I say I would like to be proven wrong, I do not mean I want you to drag out numbers right now or anything. Anybody can hand pick numbers and on top of that, that would be asking too much when I am not even a customer. What I mean is, since everybody on this forum likes your shop and I am dealing with Subaru stuff now, I hope to see consistent and good work coming out of it. It is my job to pay attention to the work you're doing and even if that can't disprove things in the past, it can prove your quality now. What I am saying, is I hope my impressions of your shop are wrong, but it will take some time seeing good work (now that I'm paying attention to the scene again) to change my mind and "prove me wrong." It was not half assed, just abbreviated. I'll simplify. I dealt with an employee of RS motors in a private deal once. The guy was either a liar or an idiot. Knowing someone like that worked there gave me some reason for concern. I cannot completely judge a whole shop on one employee, but it was concern enough to raise an eyebrow.
All that is fun and cute, except now you get to walk away with your personal suspicions, while Ron has to now deal with the PR nightmare you just created for his shop with your heresay and accusations. Moving forward, the problem that now lies ahead is that any random asshole can come on this site and make up whatever he wants, citing zero proof, and sully the good name of vendors and shops and tuners in the area that help us out. In one corner we have hundreds of good reviews and feedback from this community regarding RS and Ronnie in general. Spanning many years. He and RS have consistantly been one of the most honest and reliable shops in the area. And in the other we have you, who have been here all of a year. Citing nameless/faceless individuals that told you by word of mouth that they made inflated numbers with no paper graphs to prove it, and that some guy you had never met claimed to be an RS employee, did shady things, and kept crappy care of his own car. And of course wrx_nightcrawlers, but he's proven time and again that he needs to wear a helmet and be under constant adult supervision. But my point is, any random asshole with an axe to grind could come in here and make baseless/factless claims about a shop, badmouth them all they want, and there is no recourse for the shop/owner in this situation. He's stuck explaining away this problem. And you don't want him to pull up examples of his work to prove he's not a shady sack of crap?! He's even offering to do so, and you're telling him not to, and that he will have to earn your trust? This whole situation smells of bull****. And there will be some discussion on the administrative side about how to deal with bull**** like this in the future. I don't want our honest vendors and shops driven off because we foster a laissez-faire attitude towards these sorts of factless accusations and claims. If you intend to badmouth our vendors, you had better provide data to back it up. And by data I don't mean second hand jabberings from nameless individuals. First hand accounts matter. And RS has enough of them over the years to prove their worth around here. If anything, the people that had a bad taste in their mouths were the ones that didn't make what they thought they'd make on the dyno. This discussion is now over. If you are going to continue making claims against RS, provide proof, or keep it to yourself.
Please take note of the fact that I very intentionally and repeatedly pointed out the fact that since my experiences were indirect they should not be taken as a condemnation, but simply as a general point. A lot of people on this site seem to like RS. They probably have great reasons to do so. Unfortunately when a group so wholeheartedly supports something, others with bad experiences tend to bite their tongues and one side of an issue is never spoken about. The way everyone has jumped down my throat for voicing an unpopular opinion, no matter how careful I have been to qualify my statements so nothing is misinterpreted, shows this fact clearly. People are seeing hostile intent and dismissing valid points as baseless, because they do not want disagreement within the mass approval mentality. After the way things have been so twisted and misinterpreted do you think others with negative experiences, perhaps more concrete, would come forward? As far as wrx_nightcrawlers is concerned, I do not know his history. His original post was clearly inflamatory and lacking any substance. This is one of the reasons I tried to write something intelligible. Maybe he has an axe to grind, but occasionally people who are not capable of clear communication still have valid points. On the off chance his claim had basis, I thought I would try to provide something with some actual substance to it. Please, do not do the "you've only been here a year" bs though. That is some false elitist BS. I have only been on this site a year, but being a member of MNSubaru is not the benchmark by which you can judge my knowledge and experience. I have been active in the "car scene" for years and have had experience with many local shops over those years. I will say that I DO NOT have any axe to grind. I only wanted to convey my experiences and perhaps have an intelligent discussion about the shop. It has gone down hill from there. I accept some of the blame for that, but others being reactionary on the subject have contributed to that as well. As for him debunking any claims, I have said several times that I unfortunately do not have enough specifics to provide him for him to do so. If I did this would be a simple matter. This is gray area info and not something so easily debunked (also a good reason to take it as a general "possible problems" not a condemnation of the shop). Without that info, it would be unfair of me to ask him to provide counter info. I also am not asking him to prove anything to me I said above that it is MY job to watch his work and evaluate the shop. His work will speak for itself one way or the other. The fact that you took this the wrong way, as so many things have been in this thread, again speaks to the reactionary attitude to any negative feedback of this shop. I feel my words were very clear, but that's not what you heard at all. Please (everybody) try to see past personal biases and be rational about things.
That's just it, and precisely my point. As it stands right now, you get to dump your baseless claims on the forums with no accountability. wrx_nightcrawlers post was indeed inflammatory. And it was deleted. I left yours up because I figured you'd return to back up your claims with something other than "well, that's just like, my opinion, man." With no accountability, the burden of proof falls on the vendor. And you've already stated that you have no information that the vendor could use to clear his name. So, now there is **** on the rug, and nobody wants to clean it up, and RS motors doesn't have a wet-vac that works. Here's a fun game that will hopefully explain it to you. If I went into one of your forsale threads and said: How do you refute that? Do you have any proof to the contrary? Sure it's absurd and lacking any information that you could use to counter it. But nobody stops me from saying it. Whether you've been around the community for a while or not doesn't give you free reign to roll into this thread where a guy is asking for a tuner, and slam a suggested shop with your baseless and factless claims. You don't know the guys making the claims of inflated numbers, and then this gem: Some guy blah blah blah not sure who blah blah blah been too long to remember blah blah blah RS Motors blah blah blah. It's all entirely bull****. And I'm likely to delete it. ALSO: But Ronnie HAS TO speak up about it. Because YOU made the claim. Do you not ****ing get it? Yeah, you told us that you have zero supporting information to base your claims on. But RS now has to clear his business to the new customers that have to see this thread and read your baseless tripe. Nobody asked you to give some vague recollection about something that may or may not have happened or had to do with RS. Give your recommendation and move on. You shat on the rug, and now RS has to clean it up.
Ok, this is getting out of hand. I keep trying to clarify and you just read everything as "baseless," which will justify you in deleting whatever you disagree with. I would have thought any future readers could read my thoroughly qualified statements, factor them in along with all the other reviews/opinions (largely positive) and make their own decisions. If you feel the need to delete my posts and deny others any opinion but your own, because you have apparently decided I am making up a pile of untruthful tripe for some imagined motivation, I guess I can't do anything about that. I think that's a poor way to operate, but we're not really getting anywhere useful so I'm going to leave it as is. I will say, however, that I was not trying to dump on the thread. The topic of RS motors ability to tune was brought up. I and several others made comments in relation to the topic. As the only reasoned voice not praising and defending them, apparently I am the only one "****ting" on the thread. Anyway, I'm glad the tuning was completed. Since everybody here probably thinks I am nothing but a downer, I will say I highly recommend Nuke, who apparently did the work. That's based personal, direct experience. :slayer:
Persecution. Always the best route to travel. You're missing the point entirely. Most of the posts about RS in the thread besides yours were made as shop recommendations. Which is what the OP was asking for. And I'm sure if asked, almost all of them are going to be able to give you some sort of data to backup their opinions. Now, I'm all for reasoned debate. And I'm all for someone blasting a shop into orbit if they screw up. But if you don't have any data to backup your claims, then don't make them. If I allow your comments to stay, then I am opening up a slippery slope. Let's say SHOP A decides that their competitor SHOP B has a pretty good hold on the user base of MNSubaru. So, they decide "hey, let's have 10 or more of our friends go on MNSubaru and slam SHOP B for various reasons. Sure, we have no proof of this, but whatever, it's up to SHOP B to defend themselves." So they have their forum goons go on MNSubaru and make up a bunch of crap about SHOP B with no data or proof to back it up. Now SHOP B is running around trying to clean up their public relations issue, and SHOP A steps in and says "We do <insert product or service that SHOP B does> but we're the best." and then they have their goons come in and say "Yeah, SHOP A is the best" Yeah, it seems tin-foil hat conspiracy nonsense. But if you have a fledgeling shop and you want to bust onto the scene and destroy the competition, and you have no scruples or business ethics, you could pull something like that. If we decide users aren't accountable for their claims, and put the burden on the vendors, then vendors wont want to be a part of this place. Especially if the users are allowed to make claims with no supporting data other than "it's my opinion" to which the vendor can't defend themselves. And your claims ARE baseless. You don't have any names or cars to list so that RS can say yes or no to inflating their numbers. And you can't give a description of the person or the car in question that was outside RS for sale that may or may not have been owned by an RS employee. Where are the facts? What sort of defense can RS even put up to those claims? It's on him now. And it has nothing to do with proving it to you, you've obviously formed your opinion, it has to do with anyone else that comes along and skims this thread and reads your stuff and doesn't see any response from RS. Right, and you have data to back it up, and you've experienced this shop/tuner/company first hand. You haven't dealt with RS in any business/customer sense yet you are giving your opinion about them, and you have no supporting facts to go with it. It's hearsay, he-said/she-said crap. Again, I'll reiterate to you and everyone else. If you want to criticize RS as a business, you are more than welcome to do so. But you will do it with evidence and facts so that the vendor in question, in this case, RS, can respond with some sort of resolution to the problem. If you don't have facts to back up your claims, don't make them.
And if I do delete your posts, the only thing I'll leave up is the part about you recommending Nuke because you've used him in the past.
Since you have never had work done there, why are you posting up negative comments about them? Don't flame a well respected vendor with this crap. If you have not had work done there just read and read and read. If you could have produced some information to back up your claims this thread would have been done with days and days ago but since you cant and you cant bring yourself to apologize and say you were wrong about posting a "lie" (and i call it that since you cant provide the info to help ronnie clear his businesses name) you have now fully discredited yourself. So now just sit back and read and if you have useful information to share with the facts to back up your claims, than share, if you dont. SHUT UP!!! there is a saying in business advertising: It takes $10,000 to get 1 new customer, it takes 1 bad review to lose 10 customers. So think about what you say before trashing any business, unless you have the truth to back your mouth up.
Ok, so I can almost support deleting this entire conversation, not, because I think it would be right to delete opinions, but, because the huge extent of this conversation has given my original point way more gravity than I ever intended it to have. I meant it as a "potentially something to look out for" post. Given the huge amount of attention it has gotten, (way more than it deserved) I can imagine others who are not willing to read everything taking it as a serious slam of the shop. It is not, has never been, and never will be my intention to post anything untrue. While I stand by the truth of my statements, the sheer size of this conversation might cause others to misunderstand my meaning. For all the talk of only posting first hand experience, though, I really doubt anyone here would be upset if I said "Go to RS Motors, my friend said they were great!" That would be the exact same sort of "baseless" "lie," the only difference being that it is in agreement with everyone's opinion.
User received infraction for this stupid post. Next time it's a ban. Learn how to act around the big kids, or you'll be spending some time with your nose in the corner. -Readymix
That's because it doesn't hurt their business and doesn't require them to defend themselves against it.
There would be if someone had a legitimate reason to disagree... have you not read anything about wmc or elite motorsports (no to be confused with elite autosport)? Also, I think that the average mnsubaru user is smart enough to realize that someone is talking out of their ass with blanket claims, positive or negative... i.e: Now if he were able to qualify that with something like "I prefer Tuner X's tuning style because unlike my last 2 tuners who tuned for peak torque as soon as possible by upping the boost and advancing the timing to the ragged edge, he targeted a boost value that won't lift the heads and is still within the turbo's efficiency range and targeted slightly more aggressive timing. My peak numbers are lower with the new tune, but the usability of the power under the curve is much improved. I like the linear power band since for my application (road course), I prefer a broad and linear boost response that I can easily modulate rather than an abrupt spike in boost that feels great on the street, but is harder for me and my driving style to drive smoothly at the track..." then the community has a useful and informative opinion that they can take away from this thread. Hell, even a simple, "I prefer x over y because they are closer to my house and haven't managed to blow up my car yet" is better than some of the crap that's flying around here lately. Anyway, all I'm hearing from you, vegancowboy, is backpedaling and "I'm not saying, but I'm just saying."
Yes, WMC has a thorough review, which seems pretty clear. I have spoken to the owner over the phone and watched his ads. I have never purchased from him, but can make some assumptions based on my limited contact. It is not hard and fast info like everyone claims is so important, but has provided me some relevant insight in to his business regardless. Facts and figures are not all that matters. Impressions based on observations can be relevant. The reason it seems like I am backpedaling is, because people keep rushing to "defend" RS from my "attack" and in their enthusiasm are misinterpreting my posts. The way people are interpreting them is not at all how I intended them to be interpreted so I feel the need to clarify. I don't like people thinking I am doing something I am not, especially if it's something negative.
It IS an attack, stop putting it in quotes. It's an attack that the vendor can't defend himself against because it is based on hearsay. And I'm not defending RS, what I'm doing is defending a vendor against claims that don't have proof or facts to back them up. Put your victim card away and realize it, because I'm getting tired of hitting this ball back and forth.
I ran across this thread because I'm in need of a shop for a trans swap and help. I'm from along ways away and its hard to find good people to work with and these forums are sometimes one sided. Hearsay all the time. Whos right or wrong. Some companies can turn themselves around and some need a second chance to earn trust. My dad says look at GM. .said its not a bad thing as long as they learn from there mistakes and earn trust. He said dealing with any company big or small involves homework for trust. He hates forums of any kind and tells me not to get so caught up in them. I guess he's sort of right. My dad places his trust in independent profession independent reviewers with no axe to grind or haters. He does his homework with anything involving is house, docters, shops, even restaurants. I suppose he's obsessed but he never was steered wrong or screwed over. My dad taught us to uses better business bureau for truthful information. Every state has one i guess kind of like a school report card.kinda neat. Told me to pass it along. He said knowledge is power. WWW.bbb.com
If your father only gets his reviews from the BBB, he's a fool. The business has to actually use the BBB site to handle BBB complaints, otherwise those complaints go unresolved on the BBB site and make the company look bad. Add to that that they rarely show you what the complaint was about, or state any facts relevant to those complaints. How is that knowledge? You don't even need data or facts to file a complaint with the BBB, nor do you need to actually take up your issue with the business before filing. And who are these independent reviewers? And how are they independent? Forum users tend to be independent reviewers, unless actual customers aren't independent, at which point, who the hell cares what that person thinks of a business if they haven't done business with said company? How does your father know that an 'independent reviewer' doesn't have an axe to grind? At least with forums there is discourse between people who state facts, along with those that state hearsay comments, and sometimes outright falsehoods. But if someone makes a complaint, you can call them on the facts and hopefully either get proof of said issue, or find out that person is just talking out of their ass. In any case, there is discussion about the issue. And if the business owner is present, which is often the case on a forum that caters to their customer base, that business owner can respond publicly and openly and provide facts and data to support himself. The fact is, you, your father, the average forum user, or a potential customer cannot call BS on a BBB complaint. You can't ask for facts. Or details. All you get to see is "Company "X" has "N" number of Complaints filed with the BBB, "A" of which have gone unresolved, "B" of which have no response, "C" of which were resolved with the customer." There is no information or knowledge to be gained there.
