Story: Drive home from work. Park. No problem. Couple hours later. Start it up. Backup and it feels like I slammed on the brakes. I drive forward and same sensation. Backwards is bad, so I again drive forward and the car does ok, but there is a chatter thunking sound. Not good! I sit at idle for a long time slowly try reversing and going forward. The car runs perfectly except for the noise and slight vibration. Turns fine. Even backs up without slamming on the brakes sensation. I’m guessing this is bad, but not terrible. What do you think it is?
This: https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2194776 And this: https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2198904 I have it being looked at by a mechanic. I’ll let you know...
Took the car to Minnetonka Subaru. They don’t know what it is. The car drives normal for them now! They put it on the lift and spun a rear wheel and the front wheel spun too. Said this could be from the center diff not letting go? Said I’d be looking at thousands to tear down, fix, replace. But, they said the car drives normal so I’m ready to take it home if I want. They will try again tomorrow, but I plan on taking her home tomorrow night. Anyways, bad center diff... what are my options? I wouldn’t mind spending a grand, but I’m not spending “thousands”. Looking for advice. Car is 2003 WRX 5 speed.
CD can be replaced with the transmission in the car... they can be found online for under $500 shipped If its the diff going out the chatter/binding gets worse as it heats up. The last one I replaced would take 2-3 miles before it would start showing signs it wasn't happy & that was in summer when outside temps were high 80's
This was a problem at startup. Coldest night of the year so far. Unlikely the center diff was the issue that evening...
Any thoughts as to COLD being the issue? Part that might have frozen/locked and now has thawed. Car was parked for 2 hours only, but it was windy and 15 degrees (wind chill was probably close to zero). It was a record low that night 11/9/2017. Or, I've heard about a rock stuck in a brake area causing noise? The noise was a consistent grinding/thunking, "thunk, thunk, thunk" at 15 mph coasting straight in neutral. Didn't matter if the car was in gear or not in gear.
I would be more concerned about possibly getting water absorbed into the oil if it has no been changed somewhat regularly. Some water in the oil coupled with cold could cause some odd things. Since it has been warmer the last few days have you experienced any issues?
Just got a call from Minnetonka Subaru. They were able to get the car to experience similar symptoms today. According to them it is the center diff binding. I'm going to pick up tonight and look at a transmission shop pulling the center diff and replacing. I can get a center diff on nasioc for less than $200 and I figure that's the best scenario. They want like $3,000 to do the work.
Just out of curiosity have you looked to see if there is just another full 5 speed around for a reasonable price.
I can look into that as well. There is a very good condition center diff available on NASIOC for $100 shipped, so all I'd be looking at is costs for labor (which will be a lot). A tranny swap would be similar cost I'm sure.
You can pick up a decent 5 speed for less then $500. Or you planning to do no work on this at all yourself? Perhaps check with JM auto and see if they do any transmission work.
There are plenty of places that can do the work. I won't be able to do it on my own. If I got a tranny for $500 the cost of the labor would still be similar to just swapping the diff out. I figure $100 for the diff is the better option.
Well I got a quote for the shop I'd likely be doing the work through. $1,395 for labor (parts additional of course). Looks like I'm going to hit up some MNSubaru garage mechanics to see if someone wants to do it for about half that.
When do you plan to have it done? I'm out of town this weekend but could get it done next week/weekend assuming you have the replacement center diff by then.
I’m working out the shopping details with the guy on NASIOC. I’ve got a couple other MNSUBARU folks looking into what/how/if to do it. Drove it home from Minnetonka Subaru tonight 20+ miles. Definitely making a whirring noise. Sooner the better to get it fixed
https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2858631 This is what I’m getting for $100. Center diff from 2002 forester 5 speed. For $30 more he will add the “rear snout (couples to the diff)”. This is what I want right?
US Impreza WRX MY02 TY754VN2AA 3.454 1.947 1.366 0.972 0.738 3.333 1.100 3.900 Viscous (4kgf) Open Rev. pop-out addressed 10/01 (main shaft, rev. idler, rev. hub) US Impreza WRX MY03 TY754VN2BA 3.454 1.947 1.366 0.972 0.738 3.333 1.100 3.900 Viscous (4kgf) Open 1st, 2nd, 3rd gears widened to RA width US Impreza WRX MY04 TY754VV4AA 3.454 1.947 1.366 0.972 0.738 3.333 1.100 3.900 Viscous (4kgf) Open 3rd synchro stop changed (3/4 gear, synchro assy) US Impreza WRX late MY04 TY754VV5AA 3.454 1.947 1.366 0.972 0.738 3.333 1.100 3.900 Viscous (4kgf) Open 1st synchro changed to dual cone type? US Impreza WRX MY05 TY754VZ6AA 3.454 1.947 1.366 0.972 0.738 3.333 1.100 3.900 Viscous (4kgf) Open US Forester XT MY04 TY755VH4AA 3.454 1.947 1.366 0.972 0.738 3.333 1.000 4.444 Viscous (4kgf) Open Gears as per WRX revisions According to the chart... you need a cd with 1.1oo ratio all the forester diffs I found are 1.000
I’m seeing all Subaru 5 speed center diff were the same from about 1999 to about 2014. Im seeing the same part number. I paid the guy and it’s on the way. I think I’ll call Subaru to 100% confirm, but I’m confident.
Found this in a quick search. "What about 02+ WRX differentials? These are also phase 2 and will work in any 99+ transmission. There is some misinformation floating around that it won't work because of the 1:1.1 transfer gears. These gears are NOT in the center diff, so you'll be fine. The transfer gears are in the tail shaft." Guess you won't know for sure until you talk to Subaru.
^^^ this is correct, just pulled the tail off a spare trans, there is only spider gears & clutches in the diff itself.
So here is the latest on my symptoms. I am driving the car 5 miles each way to and from work. I'm looking into buying a 2nd car. I'M UPDATING THIS FOR FUTURE PEOPLE WHO HAVE THESE PROBLEMS. -It happened a 2nd time. Car feels "stuck" when putting it in reverse when COLD. The car gets unstuck almost immediately, and will drive as normal. -The car does make a whirring noise constantly. Sounds different when the car is going at different speeds (not rpm dependent, just speed dependent). There is no whir sound when the car is not moving. In gear or out of gear does not matter. -The whirring has been described by others as an "alien space ship" like sound. I can see where they get that. -The sound is very quiet at first and then gets a bit louder by the time I get to work 10 minutes later. -When shifting into 5th gear especially (shifting in or out) there is a noticeable vibrating noise. -The car drives normally. -I am NOT experiencing low speed sharp turn problems (which is odd as this is the standard "my center diff is blown" symptom). HOWEVER, before this noise issue I was having slight binding sensations when doing full lock parking lot turns. In truth I'm really trying NOT to do any sharp turn maneuvers for the time being. I'm gathering parts for the surgery (removal and repair of the center diff). From my symptoms I have to believe it is not really the center diff that is broken. It is most likely a bearing that has failed. I will be replacing all the bearings (and swapping in a different center diff).
Have you checked out to make sure all your axles are seated? Have you checked out the carrier bearing in the drive shaft. Kinda a long shot but if the bearings in the drive shaft were shot enough could cause some stuck feelings but I would think it would be more repeatable.
I asked the dealership to look into the driveshaft and axles as they were potential causes for my symptoms. I'm not sure they did, but they did look at the car twice and were convinced it was the center diff on the 2nd time around.
Just throwing this out there, I have the 5spd from my 02 WRX sitting around that I really don't need. I wrecked the gears due to an aggressive acceleration from a stop sign but center diff is good, only had about 80k on it when pulled. At least then if the center diff isn't the problem you wouldn't have wasted any money on a replacement.
It worked great right up until I pushed it too hard and broke *something* so I'm sure there are still some useable components, but I'd probably go new on the bearings just to be safe. You can have the whole transmission if you want it though. Only thing missing is the speed sensor that I needed to reuse.
THE CONCLUSION: The likely problem was the center differential “ring” failed. This is a ring around the end of the diff (see pics). When the car felt like the brakes were stuck, this was likely that ring being eaten by some of the center diff gears. Replaced center diff, all bearings, and all gear components in the center diff area. Total parts cost about $400 (used diff, used gears and tranny cover, new bearings and fluids). Huge thank you to Zach and his brother for taking the challenge on. Well done!
In for the diff pics! Your diff looks chewed on...good thing you had Dr. Zack look at it. He has soft hands and a steady eye!
I have heard of the snap ring being tack welded so this doesn't happen.... transfer gears look like they wuz hungray! If the spider gears in the diff itself look in good shape I have a snapring you can put in, then ya got a spare CD
