Been having some issues with the front brakes recently on the WRX (03). Some squealing while turning slightly (usually left), and even a little while backing up slow. All goes away, or seems to, when the brakes are applied. Seems to be coming from the right side, so I tore into that side first. Pulled the pads out and noticed the backs and slide points were all dried up, so a pretty easy candidate for some noise. However, the pad wear is slightly uneven (a little angle to them, maybe some slides need loving too) and I noticed a slight groove like job on the back side of the rotor. Not "terrible" but I'm not too fond of putting new pads on just to screw them up. So, most likely looking at pads and rotors at minimum, as well as some greasing as needed. Is making the jump to 4 pots right now really going to be a blow-your-mind type of improvement or is it just an unnecessary waste of money (obviously the calipers aren't cheap, even used)? Car is rapidly approaching 200k and who knows how much longer she'll keep going. That said, obligatory "suggestions for brake pads" question? I had EBC slotted rotors on there currently and don't remember the last time I did pads on the front (probably when we got the car and I put the rotors on, which most likely means they were EBC as well). Thanks!
I have read a bit on the subject and most responses were conflicted, as far as better braking... upgraded pads and high quality rotors seems to be the way to go. Make sure your current pistons move freely and new hardware for the pads to also move without hanging up/binding (light coating of grease) The 4 pot sets do look better, Good luck B
If you decide to stick with factory calipers I've got a full set of Centric PosiQuiet pads that were only used a handful of miles, no visible wear on them. They're decent, I'd consider them an upgrade from stock but still not really high-performance. They didn't seem to grab that hard on my slotted rotors so I swapped them out right away. https://mnsubaru.com/threads/gd-impreza-parts.52052/
Strongly considering this route, strictly from a budgeting standpoint. Couple hundred bucks total sounds a little better than ~$1000 right now. Cleaned up the right side pads the best I could for now. Greased the crap out of all of the contact points, and reassembled. Went for a quick spin around the hood and seemed like all the squeaking was gone, at least for now. In typical Subaru fashion, I blew a headlight bulb on the test drive and the left rear brake started making noise again. Goes away when you pull up and release the parking brake. I have read that this sometimes is caused by new rotors not having enough clearance around the backside lip and you need to shave it down a little. Somewhat recently did an H6 upgrade in the rear with new rotors, and brackets. Thoroughly cleaned and lubed everything then.
Just crossed the part numbers into Rock Auto and those are showing as early 02 fitment only. Does that seem correct to your knowledge? I know things get funky around that time period for bugeye brakes.
Not sure, I guess I just assumed they'd fit any standard bugeye 2-pots. Mine is a very early build (Sept '00) so there may be something to that.
I ran the 4 pot fronts on my wrx for a few years before switching to a full 6 speed drive line with brembos. The 4 pots made a slight improvement in braking but if I did it again I would just jump straight to brembos.
I also looked into this when having similar problems with my factory 2 pots. My issue was sticking slide pins, then a sticking/rusted piston. I ended up getting re-manufactured ones from rockauto. Be sure to use silicon grease or dielectric on the slide pins - regular oil based grease will eat up the rubber. Usually I'll clean out he slide pin areas with brake cleaner and shop towels on the end of a drill bit.
I've been happy with my 4 pot upgrade, noticeably better than the old 2 pots. If I were to do it again I would do the CTS-V brake swap. http://www.ctsvbrakeswap.com/subaru-kits This dude has all the links: I think the 4 pot swap cost me around $400 and I think the CTS-V brakes could be done for slightly more and would be much better brakes.
The only problem with that is the CTS-V is a 6 pot front caliper and only fits on 19" wheels (and a very few 18").
Before you go blowing tons of cash on brakes, identify what you're using them for. Because Subaru has upgrade options available for the calipers doesn't necessarily mean you'll get huge gains from going to Brembos/monoblock calipers. People underestimate the factory brake too often and don't correctly identify its shortfalls. The biggest thing to keep in mind is that you cannot exceed the grip capability of your tires. If you're able to lock up the tires, your brakes are going to work in regards to stopping safely. A) Choosing the right pad for your temperature range is going to be your primary consideration. DO NOT BUY TRACK OR RACE-DUTY PADS FOR STREET DRIVING. Pads that are designed for high-temp situations will not work in an emergency stop in a daily driving scenario. The pads simply don't grip until they are warm, and if you try to ask them to work cold, they'll tell you to **** yourself. Every time. B) Drilled/slotted rotors are only for style points in DD situations. It's debatable if they even make a huge difference in track situations, but pairing rotors with pads becomes a consideration for a specific duty. 1) For DD and light track duty, stock calipers are perfectly fine. However, inspect your wear components thoroughly. Pads, rotors, lines, fluid, and caliper seals/boots/guide pins are wear points. Yes, your brake lines will make a big difference. If your fluid is old, it makes a big difference. Even a good bleed on a regular interval will make a noticeable difference in feel. Inspect all these points first and address them. Stoptech makes a good ceramic street pad in regards to performance, noise, and dust. Centric PosiQuiets tend to fall right into that category as well. I personally ran Hawk HPS pads in this setup with stainless lines and it was a remarkable improvement over whatever was in there to begin with, without being noisy and dusty. I believe that HP+ pads would be a touch on the aggressive side and might not be perfectly desirable. 2) If this is a street toy that you take out for spirited driving and track days only, stock calipers are still perfectly fine. You'll just want to upgrade the brake lines to stainless units and brake fluid to a specific race formula (DOT 5 ATE fluid or Motul are good options). 3) If you're doing extended track time with the car, now you want to look into a new caliper setup, ie: Brembos. What Brembos will do for you is two-fold: First, they are a larger diameter rotor, which allows you to apply more reverse torque to the wheels, helping scrub your speed better than the factory size rotors. Second, they dissipate heat much better than iron floating calipers, which will allow you to avoid heat soak into your pads and keep your braking ability preserved for longer. Despite what people want to believe, that's about it. The 4 pots will give you that heat dissipation effect, but not the leverage since they use the same rotors. To date, I have yet to see any evidence that they can provide more clamping/braking force than the floating calipers. 4) Despite all that information, monoblock calipers do look cooler than a standard floating caliper. If you want to look cool without dropping the coin on Brembos, 4-pots will definitely do the trick and bolt right up, no new rotors or adapter brackets required. If you have more questions, there's a ton of information available on NASIOC. Additionally, most vendors I've worked with are full of useful information and are willing to help you design a brake setup for your purposes. Frozen Rotors is a local company and really good to work with, I've bought plenty of stuff from them. Also, I think KNS Brakes is still around and are equally helpful. I'm sure there's more vendors out there, but those are my two experiences in recent years.
Thanks for the info blast. My intent is daily driving with an occasional spirited session when possible (on back roads, usually). I did do Powercruise this summer but that was definitely not "racing" but also the most I've ever had to push the brakes. That being said, I do have stainless lines all around as well as a master cylinder brace. Did a fluid flush at the same time as the lines (earlier this summer) and I'm pretty sure the stuff I got was Dot 4 (that TYP200 "racing quality" stuff). Unless I can score an awesome deal on a set of 4 pots in the very near future I think I'll most likely end up just doing a rotor/pad replacement here and make sure the stock calipers are in decent shape. If one of the calipers is suspect, then I'll probably check into making the switch now.
Servicing the calipers is very important, just go over all the seals and boots and they're probably good to go. Everything else you have outlined will do the trick for you and help.
I just want to look cool. And not like the new AMG's that have a big 6 pot fixed caliper up front and a 2 pot floating caliper painted red in the back. Butt seriously, I thought I had read that the small 4pot (non brembos even) were stiffer/had less flex than the standard floating caliper. I agree you won't notice until you upgrade the lines and pads and fluid but still there might be some benefit in feel with the 4 pots.
I'm sure that's a possibility, but there's more significant mods to help with pedal feel that make a bigger difference. And pedal feel doesn't necessarily equal stopping power.
Old thread, I know... I do try to search for the answer to my question before starting a new thread and this thread seems to be the best place to post my question. Anyways, I'm interested in either going to the 4-pot/2-pot kit or the full STI Brembos for my 2017 Limited WRX. It's 99% the cool factor, 0.9% improved pedal feel, and 0.1% spirited driving. In short, I know I have no need to go beyond the stock floating calipers. Maybe a pad upgrade, stainless lines, and better fluid would get me what I want, but I've always loved the look of the gold Brembos peeking through from behind the wheels. That said, I've found a complete 4-pot/2-pot kit on fastwrx.com: https://www.fastwrx.com/products/subaru-four-pot-two-pot-full-brake-upgrade-2015-wrx It looks like the kit uses smaller diameter rotors, so I'm wondering if I might actually see reduced braking performance compared to the stock calipers and upgrading pads, lines, fluid, etc. I think the calipers look great compared to the stock floaters, but I'm not interested in trading safety for cool looks. I've found Brembos from rallysportdirect.com: https://www.rallysportdirect.com/pa...6003a4-brembo-oe-gold-slotted-brake-kit-front https://www.rallysportdirect.com/pa...-gt-systems-2-piston-rear-gold-drilled-rotors Much pricier than the 4-pot kit, but I think these would at the least be an improvement over stock so I'd get both coolness and no worse braking, yes? One thing I do wonder about changing the calipers is how would it affect the traction control, ABS, and the VDC systems?
Don’t forget a GrimmSpeed Master Cylinder Brace to stiffen it up as well! With pads, fluids, MCB, and stainless lines...you will notice MUCH better pedal feel with the stockers. You could even get some slotted rotors for the “cool factor” and paint your calipers.
Have they really not solved the weak firewall issues yet? I'd be slightly pissed if I had to put a MCB on a 2017 car. Granted most people probably thought the same thing 15 years ago when the bugeye's were coming out, but still.
I actually painted my calipers black with Por15 chassis black. I always hated rusty calipers so I figured I'd at least ward off rust before it starts when the car was fresh and new. That and I didn't want to try and show off my stock calipers with bright red paint or something. Seen too many Civics with red or yellow paint peeling off the calipers. That looks way worse, in my opinion... Not sure about fancy rotors. Everyone who knows cars I've talked to said slotted or drilled rotors are just for bling and actually tend to be more detrimental to braking performance. Yet I see some Porsches and M-series BMWs spec drilled rotors as OE. Then again, they're cranking out double the power my car has so perhaps they do need the fancy rotors. I'm on the fence about the fancy brakes. I know I have no need for them, but they sure are cool. Best value is what you guys have listed which would probably get me the vast majority of the performance a big brake kit has to offer at a fraction of the price. Heck, I'm running Michelin A/S 3+ tires so I'm probably giving up a few meters worth of stopping distance compared to high-performance summer rubber.
The slotted rotors are not for bling. They do make a difference on a race track. But for every day use you will just wear out your brake pads faster for no better braking performance. The use of the slots are to remove glazed materials from the brake pads when you have hot pads and hot rotors from track braking.
I see. Are drilled rotors just as abrasive to the pads in daily driving? I likely will do some HPDE courses and perhaps a track day here or there since a number of my friends are members of the Porsche Car Club (or whatever it's called) and have been badgering me to take my WRX out for some serious driving. Even if I do that, I still use my car for daily driving 99% of the time. So one can change pads to give better friction on the rotor for more stopping power. One can also change rotors from solid to slotted to drilled and those have different effects. Are there solid rotors made of different materials to be more effective with a certain pad? Or are all solid rotors the same?
I don't know that I've ever heard a positive benefit of having drilled rotors, unless they're the really expensive ones. All I've heard is they're very prone to cracking between holes. I did actually put them on the front of our 92 GMC truck. Needed a new caliper and rotor on one side so just bought the whole "kit" and replaced them all. For the amount it gets driven I'm not really worried about the longevity, really. But I must say they grab pretty damn hard. For a full size truck it's got better pedal feel than the WRX, which is actually kinda sad. So maybe they do perform better they just don't last as long?
What about the Cadillac Brembo conversion kit thing? Don't know a whole lot about the conversion, but seems like a reasonable price. I think it's just the front 4-pot calipers though. Then you source conversion brackets and calipers for the rear elsewhere? http://www.ctsvbrakeswap.com/subaru-kits/frs-brz-gt-86-4-piston-ats-caliper-bracket-kit
Interesting. I didn't know about the Cadillac swap. Are there issues with just swapping the fronts to better brakes alone? Wouldn't that make a heavy front bias?
I wouldn't think it would cause any issues, they front biased from the factory anyway. Looks like you'd be around $600 all in for front brembo setup using the conversion brackets. Although, having a 5x114 bolt pattern may complicate the ability to use this kit entirely...forgot about that detail. Here's a pretty decent thread...not sure if it helps at all. https://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2773522
Thinking I will save my pennies and go to the STI Brembos. I don't need them and sure don't need anything more powerful than STI-spec, and I can maintain the OE look with the gold Brembos. I could do the mods to the stock brakes, but knowing myself, I'd still be craving the STI look and just end up going down the swap path anyways so I may as well get to it. After some serious research, it seems the fronts will bolt right up and the rears require an adapter bracket and need the dust shield lip cut off to fit the larger rotor. Seems the RallySportDirect kits have everything one would need to get the job done. Pricey, but it should be a cool and fun project. B-day gift to myself. And Xmas, and New Year's, and anniversary for the next few years.
$19 for what looks like a 6-pot caliper. Not bad. Maybe I could glue together three of them and make an 18-pot mega-brake that would bend space-time if I seriously put my foot down. Even rotten kimchi couldn't cover the stink of that bad rice...
Why did I click this.... now its going to show up in all of the Amazon ads everywhere... Very curious as to which direction you go Krazy. I've had the itch to go 4pot on my bugeye as well.
I'll probably stick with what I've got for now. Unfortunately all the fun funds are being spread around multiple projects (like usual), and one of them is the shop (and I'm actually looking forward to that one).
I wouldn't have believed it unless I saw it with my own eyes and I just did on the way to Raising Cane's in Blaine. Saw a black Acura TL "Type-R" (stickers might lie, but badges are for reals) with slotted and drilled rotors with red Brembo caliper covers! Sorry, no photos since I was driving alone but this kid pulled up next to me at the stoplight at Hwy65 and 93rd and I saw the covers. Complete with white "Brembo" label and even fake bleed valve. They looked exactly like the red ones that were posted on Brembo's website cautioning about fakes.
Funny enough, Acura had caliper covers come on some models. Not quite as rad as plastic Brembo models, but still...
The Lambo clip on brake calipers are the dopery-est. Edit: https://www.google.com/shopping/pro...&ved=0ahUKEwi--7z_3frcAhUn_4MKHWSgDCcQgjYIowM
https://www.fastwrx.com/collections/brake-kits/products/subaru-6-piston-brembo-front-brake-kit Just go full retard and get the 2018 STi's! Here's a good article on rotors and what's good upgrades and not worth it.
